00:00 There’s an entire new orbital economy in
00:03
00:03 space waiting to be utilized. My
00:06
00:06 children will see trips to Mars. Like
00:08
00:08 that is incredible. It will happen. And
00:11
00:11 I think it’s now our decision as humans
00:14
00:14 to decide how we want to behave when
00:17
00:17 we’re doing that. There’s no boundaries
00:19
00:19 in space. Like there is no borders. So
00:22
00:22 who owns what and how are we interacting
00:24
00:24 with one another? That is that is really
00:26
00:26 interesting. A lot of people believe
00:29
00:29 space is the next war zone. One of the
00:31
00:31 biggest challenges that we’re facing in
00:33
00:33 our future in humanity is is how we use
00:36
00:36 space responsibly and not just destroy
00:38
00:38 it before we even benefit from it. What
00:41
00:41 sort of hostilities are you seeing in
00:43
00:43 space cuz presumably it’s a bit of a
00:45
00:45 wild west up there.
00:52
00:52 Hello and welcome to Tomorrow the Future
00:55
00:55 Forum podcast. I’m Ollie Barrett and
00:57
00:57 here at Future Forum, we are passionate
00:60
00:60 about bringing people together from very
01:01
01:01 different worlds to shape what’s next
01:04
01:04 together. Uh delighted to be joined by
01:06
01:06 my brilliant co-host Victoria Usher.
01:08
01:08 Victoria, good to see you.
01:10
01:10 >> Great to see you again, Ollie.
01:11
01:11 >> Well, you know, I’ve been excited about
01:13
01:13 this episode because 2026, Victoria, is
01:17
01:17 one of the years of a solar eclipse. So,
01:20
01:20 we’ve all been looking to the skies this
01:23
01:23 year, which gives us a clue about who
01:25
01:25 we’re about to meet. Melissa Quinn.
01:28
01:28 >> Absolutely. Melissa Quinn, she is a
01:31
01:31 space economist now a space
01:34
01:34 entrepreneur. She is doing incredible
01:36
01:36 things. She has just moved to Nova
01:39
01:39 Scotia in Canada where she is setting up
01:42
01:42 a spaceport. She previously set one up
01:45
01:45 in Cornwall. She is an absolute leading
01:48
01:48 figure in the area of space and she
01:51
01:51 believes the next industrial revolution
01:54
01:54 will happen in orbit. I can’t wait to
01:57
01:57 hear more about this.
01:59
01:59 >> Excellent. Well, I’m going to let you
02:01
02:01 take the uh controls of the spaceship
02:03
02:03 for this one, Victoria. I’m going to be
02:05
02:05 joining in and listening. But for now,
02:07
02:07 uh Melissa, welcome to Tomorrow.
02:09
02:09 >> Oh, thank you so much for having me. I’m
02:10
02:10 really excited to be here. So I want to
02:13
02:13 start Melissa by asking you if we fast
02:16
02:16 forward 10 years what will people know
02:19
02:19 about space that they don’t know now I
02:23
02:23 think that we just have a better
02:24
02:24 connection to it I think most people
02:26
02:26 feel slightly disconnected from space um
02:28
02:28 things like the solar eclipse brilliant
02:30
02:30 like people then connect they get with
02:32
02:32 their families you know it’s quite an
02:34
02:34 emotional thing um and I think more that
02:37
02:37 will continue and I think people
02:39
02:39 understanding how earth um it works with
02:42
02:42 space and it’s one and the same. Um I
02:45
02:45 think you know that will be enhanced and
02:46
02:46 this industry hasn’t been very good at
02:48
02:48 connecting earth to space but I think
02:50
02:50 the arts getting involved. We had
02:52
02:52 project hail Mary come out recently.
02:54
02:54 When you start to see more and more of
02:56
02:56 that kind of relationship between humans
02:58
02:58 and space you’ll get more interest in it
03:00
03:00 and people will feel connected to it.
03:02
03:02 And I think in 10 years time we people
03:04
03:04 will understand that we rely on space
03:06
03:06 every single day from the moment we wake
03:08
03:08 up to the moment we go to bed. And I
03:10
03:10 think more than just a practicality of
03:12
03:12 being reliant on space, I think we’ll
03:14
03:14 feel like emotionally connected to it
03:16
03:16 and its future.
03:18
03:18 >> Space is really in the headlines at the
03:20
03:20 moment. As Ollie has just said, we we’ve
03:23
03:23 had an eclipse. We’ve had a meteorite
03:25
03:25 shower that actually happened uh in the
03:27
03:27 last week. And Elon Musk, of course,
03:30
03:30 with SpaceX. It’s absolutely huge. Um so
03:34
03:34 what makes your company Maritime Launch
03:37
03:37 a really leading business? Why now? Why
03:40
03:40 is it an important business? Tell us
03:42
03:42 about it, please.
03:43
03:43 >> Yeah, so Maritime launch services, we
03:45
03:45 are a company who are building a
03:47
03:47 spaceport um and space infrastructure um
03:50
03:50 in Canada and it’s really important for
03:53
03:53 us because all the things that we’re
03:55
03:55 going to need in space um need to get to
03:57
03:57 space and they need to get to space in a
03:59
03:59 responsible way that considers uh the
04:02
04:02 environment, considers the community
04:04
04:04 that it’s in and the people that work
04:06
04:06 there. And so for us at Maritime Launch,
04:07
04:07 it’s about creating launch capability
04:09
04:09 and getting all these incredible
04:11
04:11 technologies to space in a way that’s
04:13
04:13 more responsible. And I think that’s
04:14
04:14 really important. And I think a lot of
04:16
04:16 people when they think about space
04:18
04:18 launch and rockets, they do think of
04:20
04:20 companies like SpaceX and they they
04:22
04:22 might have interesting connotations
04:23
04:23 around that and the people that work
04:25
04:25 there. Uh and for us, you know, we see
04:27
04:27 both sides of it. We do understand
04:29
04:29 there’s a lot of concern. Um, but we
04:30
04:30 also understand that we are desperate
04:32
04:32 for space satellite technology and
04:35
04:35 communications to make us more safe here
04:37
04:37 on planet Earth. So, we want to like
04:39
04:39 bridge that gap, let’s just say, and and
04:41
04:41 create launch and create a spaceport
04:43
04:43 that considers how we are getting to
04:45
04:45 space in a more responsible way.
04:48
04:48 >> And tell us about a spaceport. What does
04:51
04:51 it actually do? I’m assuming it sends
04:53
04:53 rockets up into space, things like
04:54
04:54 satellites. What kind of materials are
04:57
04:57 you taking up into space?
04:58
04:58 >> Yeah, exactly. A spaceport is a port to
05:01
05:01 space just as a marine port or a train
05:03
05:03 station or an airport. If you think of
05:05
05:05 it in that way, we’ll maybe talk about a
05:06
05:06 little bit about why that’s important in
05:08
05:08 a bit. Um, for me, it’s really important
05:10
05:10 that we consider a spaceport as a port
05:13
05:13 because we are going to be moving goods,
05:15
05:15 services, and people from Earth to to
05:18
05:18 space. And a lot of that’s already
05:20
05:20 happening, but there’s only a few places
05:22
05:22 around the world you can currently do
05:23
05:23 that from. So diversifying those those
05:26
05:26 locations so that we can offer a
05:28
05:28 different way to get to space um
05:31
05:31 different location to get to space from
05:33
05:33 and open up access to space for more
05:36
05:36 people for more goods. So whether that
05:38
05:38 is satellites or you know infrastructure
05:40
05:40 that needs to go up to the moon or
05:42
05:42 humans that need to go and do further
05:44
05:44 research that’s what our spaceport will
05:46
05:46 be all about moving goods services and
05:48
05:48 people um from earth to space
05:51
05:51 >> and you already set up a spaceport in
05:54
05:54 Cornwall which was the first time I’d
05:56
05:56 ever heard about that. I I only thought
05:58
05:58 people went to Cornwall for green teas.
06:00
06:00 Um, so tell us a little bit about what
06:02
06:02 you did in Cornwall and how you’re
06:04
06:04 taking the understanding and the
06:06
06:06 learnings from that experience up to
06:09
06:09 Nova Scotia where you are now. Yeah, it
06:11
06:11 was incredible journey. It was quite a
06:13
06:13 roller coaster. So it was back all the
06:15
06:15 way back in 2014 the UK decided to to go
06:18
06:18 on a spaceport journey. Um, the UK build
06:21
06:21 a large majority of the world’s small
06:22
06:22 satellites and every single one of them
06:24
06:24 were getting shipped overseas to launch.
06:25
06:25 And so the UK wanted to capture that
06:27
06:27 market and they created um a opportunity
06:29
06:29 for a few sites around the UK and
06:31
06:31 Cornwall was one of them and I had the
06:34
06:34 absolute p privilege of running that
06:36
06:36 spaceport. So building that from the
06:37
06:37 ground up for over 10 years um which
06:40
06:40 culminated in the first ever orbital
06:42
06:42 launch um with u one of Sir Richard
06:45
06:45 Branson’s companies Virgin Orbit in
06:46
06:46 2023. So it was really exciting. Um, it
06:50
06:50 showed it provided just an amazing use
06:52
06:52 case to how a rural community, which is
06:55
06:55 where most of these spaceports are, who
06:57
06:57 might have traditional industries like
06:58
06:58 mining and fishing and farming, can
07:01
07:01 diversify and and use um space
07:04
07:04 technology to kind of galvanize economic
07:07
07:07 development, job creation as well. And
07:09
07:09 so, yeah, taking all those learnings
07:11
07:11 from the technical side to the
07:13
07:13 infrastructure side to really the
07:15
07:15 community and and how we worked with the
07:17
07:17 community to develop um that
07:19
07:19 relationship to encourage them to be
07:22
07:22 part of it, whether that’s through
07:24
07:24 outreach uh educational outreach or
07:26
07:26 through even environmental um
07:27
07:27 considerations. And so taking all of
07:30
07:30 those learnings over here to Nova
07:31
07:31 Scotia, which is actually quite a
07:33
07:33 similar lo location, similar small
07:36
07:36 community, fishing, mining, forestry.
07:39
07:39 It’s it’s really interesting to see the
07:41
07:41 the similarities, obviously some
07:43
07:43 differences, but you know, the learnings
07:45
07:45 that we had. Nobody had done it before
07:46
07:46 in the UK and nobody has done it here in
07:49
07:49 Canada. So it’s I feel like again, it’s
07:52
07:52 just so lucky to be involved in another
07:53
07:53 one um and to have that experience as
07:56
07:56 well.
07:57
07:57 And Melissa, you told me a wonderful
07:60
07:60 story about Extinction Rebellion and it
08:03
08:03 was a real story about human connection
08:05
08:05 and trying to really understand
08:08
08:08 somebody’s push back and their rationale
08:10
08:10 and you sat down person to person and
08:13
08:13 talk to them about their their issues
08:15
08:15 with what you were doing in Cornwall. So
08:18
08:18 can you tell us a little bit more about
08:19
08:19 that, please? Yeah, it was um a few
08:22
08:22 years ago at the height of and you might
08:24
08:24 you remember in London there was a lot
08:26
08:26 of protests from extinction rebellion
08:28
08:28 and you know the same was in Cornwall
08:30
08:30 and they saw this big infrastructure
08:32
08:32 project happening and the words rockets
08:34
08:34 and you know big company like Virgin
08:37
08:37 Group and there was obviously concern
08:39
08:39 and um it got quite heated and you can
08:42
08:42 you know look online and see some of the
08:44
08:44 the Cormal council meetings where we had
08:46
08:46 members of Extinction Rebellion
08:48
08:48 protesting outside or inside the
08:49
08:49 cabinet. itself and the chamber. Um, so
08:52
08:52 yeah, it was it was pretty intense and
08:54
08:54 we understood because I think there’s a
08:56
08:56 complete like I said disconnect. People
08:58
08:58 don’t understand that most of our
08:59
08:59 climate modeling comes from space. Most
09:02
09:02 of the efficiencies that we’re getting
09:03
09:03 in the shipping industry come from
09:05
09:05 better GPS navigation. So space has like
09:09
09:09 any huge role a critical role in helping
09:11
09:11 us fight against climate change and but
09:14
09:14 there’s this irony of getting the you
09:16
09:16 know these items to space is has a
09:18
09:18 negative environmental impact and it was
09:20
09:20 really important to me that we brought
09:22
09:22 it down to earth. We brought it down to
09:24
09:24 the human a human human story and and
09:26
09:26 reaching out to one of the heads of
09:28
09:28 Extinction Rebellion locally was really
09:30
09:30 important to me because it can all
09:32
09:32 happen online and all these
09:33
09:33 conversations, but if you sit down with
09:35
09:35 somebody over a cup of coffee and talk
09:37
09:37 to him about their concerns, um you you
09:39
09:39 go you get a lot further and I’m not
09:41
09:41 afraid to do that. Um I think it’s
09:43
09:43 really important. So for me, we sat
09:45
09:45 down, we had a conversation over a cup
09:47
09:47 of coffee. And it culminated in uh an
09:50
09:50 offer from from me to create a a
09:53
09:53 satellite um in the future for
09:55
09:55 environmental reasons. And I just asked
09:57
09:57 him, I said, “What would you you know
09:58
09:58 what what would we we monitor?” And we
10:01
10:01 came up with the coastal health of
10:03
10:03 Cornwall. So the water quality around
10:05
10:05 Cornwall and using a satellite to
10:07
10:07 monitor that. And that actually then
10:09
10:09 created a project called kernelat which
10:11
10:11 is still alive and well today which
10:13
10:13 kernel is is Cornish for Cornwall uh
10:16
10:16 about exactly that monitoring the
10:18
10:18 coastal health of Cornwall. And so I
10:20
10:20 think if you do have these these
10:22
10:22 challenges um a lot of it comes from
10:24
10:24 just miscommunication or education and
10:27
10:27 it’s not about the greenwashing or
10:29
10:29 sitting there and telling them you know
10:30
10:30 what it’s it’s it’s that engaging piece
10:32
10:32 and it’s it’s both ways and again
10:34
10:34 bringing that over here to Nova Scotia
10:36
10:36 where of course again there’s local
10:37
10:37 environmental concerns you know I’m very
10:39
10:39 happy to go and sit and have you know
10:41
10:41 quite challenging and difficult
10:42
10:42 conversations.
10:45
10:45 It it sounds like that was a real lesson
10:47
10:47 in negotiation and trust building that
10:50
10:50 could have actually escalated very badly
10:52
10:52 and caused problems for your project. Uh
10:56
10:56 you told me a similar story about a
10:59
10:59 first nation interaction again that was
11:02
11:02 to do with trust more on the home ground
11:04
11:04 where you are now I believe. Um would
11:06
11:06 love to hear that story. Yeah. Coming to
11:09
11:09 Canada where I’m originally from, you
11:11
11:11 know, you grow up understanding that
11:13
11:13 nature is is part and parcel of of of
11:16
11:16 doing anything in Canada as well as the
11:18
11:18 First Nations who have you there they’re
11:21
11:21 they’re indigenous places to to live and
11:24
11:24 to work and to to have a life. And if
11:27
11:27 you’re working on those pieces of land
11:29
11:29 that it has to be acknowledged and it
11:30
11:30 has to be in partnership 100%. My
11:33
11:33 parents growing up in Canada, their jobs
11:35
11:35 were exactly that as well. So the team
11:38
11:38 here have already done a lot of work
11:39
11:39 with the local first nations, the big
11:41
11:41 mall community and it’s to a point now
11:44
11:44 where we’ve had one of the chiefs come
11:46
11:46 and do a blessing for a recent
11:47
11:47 suborbital launch. They’re really
11:49
11:49 excited. Um it’s it it is a long journey
11:53
11:53 and again you can look and see people
11:55
11:55 that have maybe not done it the right
11:56
11:56 way. Um but Canada’s very very uh has
12:00
12:00 the structure in place now to do that
12:02
12:02 engagement uh in the right way. like
12:05
12:05 there’s no excuse, absolutely not, to
12:07
12:07 not go and have those conversations. And
12:09
12:09 for us, it’s again going back to
12:11
12:11 outreach and engagement, getting that
12:13
12:13 social license long before you get a you
12:16
12:16 know, any sort of digger involved and
12:18
12:18 get infrastructure going. If you do not
12:20
12:20 have that social license and the
12:22
12:22 community engagement, right, any
12:24
12:24 infrastructure build is going to crack.
12:26
12:26 It’s just not going to work. And I have
12:28
12:28 seen and you can look up other
12:30
12:30 spaceports in these rural environments
12:31
12:31 that have done it maybe not responsibly
12:34
12:34 and it will always come back to to bite
12:37
12:37 them. And I think you know doing it and
12:39
12:39 then having the integrity to continue to
12:41
12:41 to have that communication. So we have a
12:43
12:43 community liaison committee here which
12:46
12:46 we meet quarterly
12:48
12:48 pros people for the project people
12:50
12:50 against the project. We all come
12:52
12:52 together and we talk through what’s
12:53
12:53 going on. And I think that open dialogue
12:55
12:55 has to be part of it with any
12:57
12:57 stakeholders. And in Canada, number one
12:59
12:59 stakeholder obviously is the land that
13:01
13:01 we’re we’re working on whose whose owner
13:03
13:03 that is. And that is the MiGma First
13:04
13:04 Nations here. I’d like to move on to the
13:08
13:08 economics of space. Now, now when we
13:11
13:11 spoke before, you talked about this
13:13
13:13 moment in time being like the 1600s,
13:17
13:17 those days we read about in history
13:19
13:19 books about the exploration of new
13:22
13:22 nations across the sea. Tell us the
13:25
13:25 analogy between those times and what’s
13:28
13:28 happening now and what you can see as
13:30
13:30 the potential for the future.
13:32
13:32 >> Yeah, and I think I’m I’m not
13:34
13:34 necessarily a big space geek. People are
13:37
13:37 surprised by that. What I love about
13:39
13:39 space is the opportunity for people on
13:42
13:42 Earth um to to optimize and benefit from
13:45
13:45 it. And we are now seeing only the cusp
13:49
13:49 of what that’s going to look like. It is
13:52
13:52 depending on what what you’re reading at
13:53
13:53 least worth a trillion um to to our
13:57
13:57 economies. um if we utilize it in the
13:59
13:59 right way and if we go up there and we
14:01
14:01 set up um data centers and I know that’s
14:04
14:04 a hot topic at the moment or working
14:07
14:07 through some of the amazing
14:09
14:09 opportunities that there are to do
14:11
14:11 testing and manufacturing
14:13
14:13 uh on orbit instead of on Earth um which
14:16
14:16 is more efficient cancer research all
14:18
14:18 these incredible things that we can take
14:19
14:19 up to space and so there’s entire new
14:21
14:21 orbital economy in space waiting to be
14:25
14:25 utilized and if you use the analogy of
14:28
14:28 the 1600s when Europe and I I will put
14:30
14:30 the hideousness of colonization to one
14:33
14:33 side from an economic perspective. You
14:36
14:36 had government supports to go out to
14:38
14:38 explore. You had private companies with
14:41
14:41 with the bankroll to to build the ships
14:44
14:44 to build the ports to go and to see what
14:46
14:46 resource was in the new world. That is
14:48
14:48 where we’re at right now. You’re seeing
14:50
14:50 governments and you’re seeing private
14:52
14:52 companies and you’re seeing these ports
14:54
14:54 starting to get built and you’re
14:55
14:55 starting to see these these ships, these
14:57
14:57 rockets starting to be built to go and
14:59
14:59 start to explore what is this new
15:01
15:01 resource? How can we access that? And
15:04
15:04 that’s exactly where we are right now.
15:06
15:06 Like my children will see trips to Mars.
15:09
15:09 Like that is incredible. It will happen.
15:12
15:12 And I think it’s now our decision as
15:14
15:14 humans um to decide how we want to
15:18
15:18 behave when we’re doing that. And that
15:21
15:21 is the real challenge I think that we
15:23
15:23 have. I think the technology um the
15:25
15:25 industry the financialdriven kind of
15:28
15:28 motivation will be there and it will
15:30
15:30 happen. But I think the behavior then of
15:32
15:32 once we are starting to to go up there
15:34
15:34 there’s no there’s no um boundaries in
15:37
15:37 space like there is no borders. So who
15:40
15:40 owns what and how are we interacting
15:42
15:42 with one another? That is that is really
15:44
15:44 interesting and I think taking the
15:46
15:46 learnings of that period of time of
15:48
15:48 exploration in the 1600s what happened
15:51
15:51 when colonization we do not want to
15:53
15:53 create those same um mistakes. So again
15:56
15:56 like let’s go for it absolutely it’s
15:58
15:58 going to happen but let’s let’s let’s
16:01
16:01 look at that behavior piece. I want to
16:03
16:03 ask you about satellites as well because
16:06
16:06 we see them go overhead in the night sky
16:09
16:09 and they are driving everything from
16:11
16:11 GPS, weather forecasting, as you said,
16:15
16:15 they play a big part in the
16:17
16:17 environmental drive. What is the next
16:20
16:20 generation of satellites going to be
16:22
16:22 capable of? Oh gosh. I mean, it’s it’s
16:25
16:25 the stuff of I sit in these conferences
16:28
16:28 and they’re never boring because it’s
16:31
16:31 like I’ve seen people talking about 3D
16:33
16:33 printing carrots on the moon and uh it
16:36
16:36 it’s incredible. Um I think the biggest
16:39
16:39 thing coming for us is um is satellites
16:42
16:42 direct to your your mobile. So you will
16:44
16:44 no matter where you are on the planet
16:46
16:46 have you know that 5G signal um through
16:50
16:50 through direct to device um
16:52
16:52 communication. So that’s the hot topic
16:54
16:54 right now is you can be in a Nuvic,
16:57
16:57 which is in the far north of Canada, and
16:59
16:59 have just as good a connection as you
17:01
17:01 would in in a city center. Um, so that
17:04
17:04 is the the big push right now. And I
17:06
17:06 think um anybody that’s been on a
17:08
17:08 airplane recently, you’ll see you’ll
17:09
17:09 start to see that little satellite
17:11
17:11 signal. That’s the beginning of it. You
17:13
17:13 know, my uh colleague yesterday was
17:15
17:15 saying that he was on a plane recently
17:17
17:17 in the US and his phone started ringing
17:20
17:20 like it’s it’s here. it’s happening. Um,
17:23
17:23 so I would say that’s a big a big thing
17:25
17:25 because if you think of how that will
17:26
17:26 change people’s lives, it’s going to
17:28
17:28 take the need for fiber out in rural
17:32
17:32 parts of Africa. They’re not going to
17:34
17:34 need the heavy infrastructure to get
17:35
17:35 techn that internet technology to them.
17:39
17:39 Um, and I don’t think we’ve even
17:40
17:40 understood how that could that that
17:43
17:43 education can can change a lot. Um, so I
17:46
17:46 do think that’s a huge huge one that we
17:49
17:49 shouldn’t underestimate. And I I was on
17:51
17:51 a recently a panel and uh we had a a
17:54
17:54 guy, a marine, and he was talking about
17:56
17:56 the emergency piece of rescuing people
17:59
17:59 and how quickly they’re able to start
18:01
18:01 rescuing people to the point that
18:03
18:03 they’ve had to change their training for
18:04
18:04 their new recruits because it’s not as
18:06
18:06 hard as it once was because they’re
18:08
18:08 instantly with their with their, you
18:11
18:11 know, satellite direct device, they’re
18:12
18:12 able to get pinged right away. So the
18:15
18:15 the opportunities there for for human
18:18
18:18 well-being is is incredible.
18:20
18:20 >> So given the scope of what this kind of
18:23
18:23 technology is going to be able to
18:25
18:25 achieve, I imagine it’s very important
18:29
18:29 for countries to have their own launch
18:31
18:31 capabilities.
18:33
18:33 >> Yeah, it is. It’s um the whole word word
18:38
18:38 sovereignty is like that’s everywhere in
18:40
18:40 this industry right now. What that means
18:43
18:43 is a different story. So, I think it’s
18:45
18:45 very hard to build a spaceport. It’s
18:47
18:47 very hard to build your own rocket. It’s
18:50
18:50 decades. We haven’t standardized it yet.
18:52
18:52 That might be coming for sure. But at
18:54
18:54 the moment, as it stands right now,
18:56
18:56 countries really, if they’re going to
18:58
18:58 spend hundreds of millions, if not
19:00
19:00 billions, on a satellite communication
19:03
19:03 network or a uh piece of infrastructure,
19:06
19:06 satellite technology that’s going into
19:08
19:08 space to help their emergency management
19:10
19:10 teams. They want to be able to protect
19:12
19:12 that in space themselves or replace it
19:14
19:14 or replenish it if it breaks down and
19:16
19:16 not h constantly have to rely on other
19:18
19:18 countries. It’s becoming another kind of
19:21
19:21 area of of security um for countries
19:25
19:25 unfortunately uh in this world. It’s
19:28
19:28 it’s not necessarily a a very peaceful
19:30
19:30 place. Um, so having the ability to
19:33
19:33 protect your own assets in space, which
19:35
19:35 usually means yes, if you can uh replace
19:38
19:38 a satellite or if you can launch
19:40
19:40 something that you need critically,
19:43
19:43 previously you would have had to wait
19:45
19:45 months to get on a uh maybe a SpaceX
19:48
19:48 launch. And now we’re looking at, you
19:50
19:50 know, potentially even weeks or or if
19:52
19:52 not uh days. And so countries wanting to
19:56
19:56 create their own space ports and is is
19:58
19:58 now becoming more viable. Um the
20:00
20:00 challenge still is the rockets to then
20:02
20:02 launch from there. And so you’re
20:04
20:04 starting to see new rocket companies
20:05
20:05 starting that are creating a mobile
20:08
20:08 business model where they can move their
20:11
20:11 rockets around the world to launch from
20:13
20:13 different spaceports. Um and that is
20:16
20:16 that is definitely something that’s
20:18
20:18 changed um more recently is that
20:20
20:20 business model of of these rocket
20:22
20:22 companies isn’t just like I’m just going
20:24
20:24 to launch from this location. Everybody
20:25
20:25 bring their satellites here and this is
20:26
20:26 where we launch from. it’s now, oh,
20:29
20:29 actually, I’m going to bring my rocket
20:30
20:30 to your market. Um, and I think that’s
20:33
20:33 really interesting as a as a as a new
20:35
20:35 way of doing things.
20:37
20:37 >> Surely there must be standards and
20:39
20:39 things around launching a little bit
20:41
20:41 like a an airport. You know, you’ve got
20:43
20:43 the standards across airlines across the
20:46
20:46 world. Could you have dubious third
20:48
20:48 parties that have got launches that
20:51
20:51 aren’t as friendly? How does it all
20:54
20:54 work?
20:54
20:54 >> Yeah, right now it’s pretty it’s pretty
20:56
20:56 much like that. there’s some dubious
20:57
20:57 launches going on for sure cuz there’s
20:60
20:60 not necessarily it’s not as regulated as
21:02
21:02 the airline industry. That is definitely
21:04
21:04 where we want to go. And each country
21:07
21:07 that is now newly launching has their
21:09
21:09 own regulations. Um so I actually helped
21:12
21:12 we were the first to get regulated in
21:14
21:14 the UK with the Civil Aviation
21:16
21:16 Authority. Um so they’re up and running.
21:19
21:19 We’re going through that process now in
21:21
21:21 Canada with the with Transport Canada.
21:23
21:23 brand new regulations on how to launch
21:25
21:25 to space and they’re all learning from
21:27
21:27 each other, but they’re all also there’s
21:29
21:29 nuances to every place around the world
21:31
21:31 and how they interact with airspace, how
21:33
21:33 they interact with with commercial
21:35
21:35 airlines for instance. Um, so it’s it’s
21:38
21:38 really layered. Um, so as that
21:40
21:40 regulatory piece is getting figured out,
21:42
21:42 the US have been doing it for a very
21:44
21:44 very long time. Um, and so we’re all
21:46
21:46 looking still to them, but there are
21:48
21:48 spots in the world where maybe it’s not
21:49
21:49 as regulated. But if we if we layer on
21:52
21:52 the airspace and and and aviation piece,
21:56
21:56 that’s where you start to see that we
21:58
21:58 can standardize globally cuz people do
21:60
21:60 tend to respect aviation regulations and
22:04
22:04 because rockets have to trans transfer
22:07
22:07 through um those airways, we we do
22:10
22:10 actually have to interact there too. So
22:13
22:13 using aviation as a model is a really
22:16
22:16 good starting point. There’s there’s
22:18
22:18 different levels though with with space
22:20
22:20 itself because it’s basically a you know
22:22
22:22 it’s a rocket that could go off course
22:25
22:25 way faster than an airplane could and
22:27
22:27 then once it gets beyond you know the
22:29
22:29 35,000 ft starts to hit space itself
22:33
22:33 there’s different regulations around um
22:36
22:36 not hitting you know other satellites
22:39
22:39 that are up there. So there’s a lot more
22:41
22:41 consideration but definitely taking um
22:44
22:44 uh aviation regulation is is a big one.
22:46
22:46 So most of the time what you’ll see
22:47
22:47 globally is aviation regulators like the
22:50
22:50 FAA or the CIA having a space launch arm
22:53
22:53 to them. So it’s a bolt-on from there.
22:56
22:56 When you mention about satellites
22:59
22:59 crashing into other satellites,
23:02
23:02 what sort of hostilities are you seeing
23:04
23:04 in space because presumably it’s a bit
23:06
23:06 of a wild west up there.
23:08
23:08 >> Yeah, space a great term for it. I spent
23:10
23:10 a few years in between Spaceport Cormal
23:12
23:12 and Spaceport Nova Scotia. I took um a
23:16
23:16 bit of time to to to be part of a
23:18
23:18 different part of the industry which was
23:20
23:20 um space domain awareness and space
23:22
23:22 traffic management. So we the company I
23:25
23:25 worked for we we had these uh sensors
23:27
23:27 and telescopes that could see out to uh
23:29
23:29 geostationary orbit and it was pretty
23:31
23:31 scary some of the stuff we were seeing
23:32
23:32 and some of the behaviors and um I’m not
23:35
23:35 a scaremonger but I think it’s important
23:37
23:37 to understand that a lot of people
23:39
23:39 believe space is the next war zone and
23:42
23:42 that we need to start to look at how we
23:45
23:45 are um considering nefarious activity
23:48
23:48 and adversarial um activities in space
23:51
23:51 and we are seeing some of those now. So
23:53
23:53 whether it is yes um purposely you know
23:57
23:57 uh destroying somebody else’s satellite
23:59
23:59 all the way out to putting uh warheads
24:02
24:02 in space to using AI to do spying and
24:05
24:05 spoofing in space as well. So we are
24:08
24:08 starting to see some of that from um
24:10
24:10 nefarious actors. It is a real thing.
24:13
24:13 Um, and that’s why ensuring that we are
24:17
24:17 working with entities like the United
24:19
24:19 Nations to protect um, and continue the
24:22
24:22 peaceful use of outer space is so
24:24
24:24 crucially important. Um because if it
24:28
24:28 continues to be the wild west at any
24:29
24:29 point all the potential benefits that
24:31
24:31 we’ve talked about earlier could be
24:33
24:33 wiped out by just uh a a poorly made
24:36
24:36 decision of somebody trying to ex you
24:38
24:38 know blow up somebody else’s satellite
24:40
24:40 that then creates a field of debris that
24:43
24:43 you know is called the Kesler syndrome
24:44
24:44 and it will continue to hit other pieces
24:47
24:47 of a satellite and then it just goes and
24:49
24:49 goes and goes and people say if that
24:50
24:50 ever happened we could you know maybe
24:52
24:52 not use space for up to 30 years by the
24:54
24:54 time we could clean it
24:56
24:56 So there’s a whole group of really
24:58
24:58 incredible talented uh smart people
25:01
25:01 working on this problem. But it is a
25:02
25:02 massive challenge. I would say it’s one
25:04
25:04 of the biggest challenges that we’re
25:06
25:06 facing in our future um in humanity is
25:09
25:09 is how we use space um responsibly and
25:12
25:12 not just destroy it before we even
25:14
25:14 benefit from it. Melissa, with the
25:16
25:16 benefit of hindsight and your chapter in
25:19
25:19 the UK, what would you say to Britain in
25:22
25:22 terms of where we can play a role in the
25:25
25:25 future of space, what we’ve got going
25:27
25:27 for ourselves, and what you’d
25:28
25:28 encouraging us uh what you’d encourage
25:30
25:30 us to do more of.
25:31
25:31 >> Um, so there’s some obviously some great
25:33
25:33 heritage in in the UK and um I was so
25:37
25:37 proud to be part of some of that. It’s
25:38
25:38 incredible. Um I I mentioned, you know,
25:41
25:41 spacecraft manufacturing, some of the
25:43
25:43 robotics going on there. Absolutely. But
25:46
25:46 I think and this might sound boring to
25:48
25:48 some people listening um but
25:50
25:50 legislation, insurance, uh legal
25:53
25:53 support, those areas that the UK are
25:57
25:57 amazing at across the board in other
25:58
25:58 industries, we need that in space big
26:01
26:01 time. So insurance for instance,
26:04
26:04 ensuring uh rocket launches, ensuring
26:07
26:07 space ports, ensuring the spacecraft
26:09
26:09 that go up in a way that’s practical and
26:11
26:11 affordable is a hu huge area. uh gap in
26:15
26:15 the market. Um yes, it does sound dull,
26:18
26:18 but these things make or break um that
26:20
26:20 responsible behavior. Um and and yeah,
26:23
26:23 the legal part of it. So, how do we
26:25
26:25 bring in legislation that again works
26:27
26:27 for the industry, especially I think
26:30
26:30 because some of some of the main space
26:32
26:32 players that are already long gone into
26:34
26:34 launching um they’re kind of driving
26:36
26:36 what’s going on and and we’re kind of
26:39
26:39 trying to catch up with the regulations
26:42
26:42 and legislation. And what I’m really
26:44
26:44 worried about is that harms some of the
26:46
26:46 startup companies, some of the new
26:48
26:48 companies rather than, you know, some of
26:50
26:50 these big companies that will just pay a
26:52
26:52 fine and and don’t care. And so I think
26:54
26:54 the UK could have a really interesting
26:56
26:56 role there and in galvanizing the global
26:59
26:59 kind of economy around how do we do this
27:01
27:01 right and there’s some amazing
27:02
27:02 institutions already starting. So uh
27:05
27:05 King Charles has started something
27:06
27:06 called the Astracarta uh which is
27:09
27:09 incredible and uh based out of the UK
27:11
27:11 but is a global kind of uh call to arms
27:14
27:14 around how do we protect space for our
27:16
27:16 future. Um the earth and space
27:19
27:19 sustainability institute is based in in
27:21
27:21 the UK as well. So I think there’s such
27:23
27:23 a huge role for the UK to play on some
27:25
27:25 of those more kind of regulatory,
27:27
27:27 legislated, legal and insurance parts as
27:30
27:30 well as of course amazing technology
27:32
27:32 too. But I think the UK from my last
27:36
27:36 five years there uh some of the ambition
27:38
27:38 feels like it’s gone and I think you
27:40
27:40 know UK space agency moving into more
27:43
27:43 government focused kind of body um it
27:47
27:47 just feels like a lot of that kind of
27:49
27:49 more innovative um mindset a bit more
27:53
27:53 risktaking that we do need in this
27:55
27:55 industry is is maybe not there anymore.
27:58
27:58 And so if that’s not going to be there,
27:59
27:59 then let’s go down that really pragmatic
28:01
28:01 practical,
28:03
28:03 you know, that that side, call it what
28:05
28:05 it is and and to do do that really
28:07
28:07 really well.
28:09
28:09 >> Right. And to your challenge, let’s not
28:11
28:11 lose that ambition. My final question is
28:14
28:14 really when you’re looking about other
28:16
28:16 areas, aircraft,
28:19
28:19 vehicles, cars, the future seems to be
28:22
28:22 all about not having drivers. So, what
28:26
28:26 future do you think we humans have in
28:28
28:28 space and why?
28:31
28:31 >> Um, I have met some people I’ve met
28:35
28:35 quite a few people that have been to
28:36
28:36 space. Um, and we they talk about the
28:39
28:39 overview effect, you know, of looking
28:41
28:41 back on planet Earth. I think you can
28:44
28:44 never replace a human going to space and
28:47
28:47 looking back on Earth. And I 100%
28:50
28:50 believe we should have more artists out
28:52
28:52 there, more, you know, creative people
28:54
28:54 that can come and communicate what
28:56
28:56 that’s like and make us consider, you
28:59
28:59 know, this amazing planet that we live
29:01
29:01 on in a way that’s maybe more digestible
29:04
29:04 to the average person on the street.
29:05
29:05 It’s all fine having astronauts up there
29:07
29:07 and scientists, but it’s sometimes
29:09
29:09 they’re maybe not the best at coming
29:11
29:11 back and communicating that. I think
29:12
29:12 Artsmist uh the recent Arts Miss and I
29:15
29:15 was so lucky to have Jeremy Hansen at
29:16
29:16 our uh recent suborbital launch and it’s
29:20
29:20 there the aura that they carry and the
29:22
29:22 ability that they had to communicate
29:24
29:24 that back was way better than anything
29:25
29:25 else I’ve seen in the past. But imagine
29:27
29:27 if we could bring artists up there um
29:29
29:29 more in a way that they can then come
29:31
29:31 back and and communicate that. Um I do
29:34
29:34 think there’s always going to be a role
29:36
29:36 for humans and I think going forward in
29:38
29:38 the future human making decision around
29:41
29:41 you know is this right for humanity is
29:43
29:43 this right for all of us not just the
29:46
29:46 bottom line or that piece of technology
29:48
29:48 but I think it’s really important that
29:49
29:49 we keep space human um if we’re if we’re
29:53
29:53 really serious about making it you know
29:55
29:55 keeping it a de democratic place to be.
29:59
29:59 Melissa, you’ve worked with government,
30:02
30:02 military, entrepreneurs, local
30:05
30:05 communities. There is no playbook for
30:08
30:08 this activity. Nobody has ever done this
30:11
30:11 before. What have you learned?
30:14
30:14 >> Yeah, it’s a challenge. Um, definitely,
30:16
30:16 but I think it’s getting everybody
30:19
30:19 together um and deciding what our
30:23
30:23 purpose is. Why are we doing this? And
30:25
30:25 what is that motivation that everybody
30:26
30:26 shares? And there will always be
30:28
30:28 something that everybody shares. And in
30:30
30:30 Cornwall, it was our purpose ended up
30:32
30:32 being space for good. We all wanted to
30:35
30:35 do this for um mostly the the children,
30:39
30:39 the next generation. We we sat down and
30:41
30:41 room all those stakeholders and we
30:43
30:43 decided is this what’s right for
30:44
30:44 Cornwall and the UK and you know the
30:47
30:47 children and the future of it. And and
30:48
30:48 that was it. We use the word space for
30:50
30:50 good. So that we ran that filtration
30:52
30:52 through everything even the military
30:54
30:54 like how how is this space for good for
30:55
30:55 what we need to do to protect the UK. Um
30:59
30:59 and so I think finding that purpose and
31:01
31:01 then that drives everybody else even if
31:02
31:02 you have conflicting kind of views of
31:04
31:04 things is the space for good in Canada
31:07
31:07 right now. You might have heard that the
31:09
31:09 saying Canada strong uh the prime
31:10
31:10 minister is using it a lot right now and
31:12
31:12 we’re and that’s the thing. So is this
31:15
31:15 good for Canada and and how Canada and
31:17
31:17 the values of Canadians around the
31:19
31:19 world, you know, being known for being
31:21
31:21 capable and kind and doing the right
31:23
31:23 thing when it matters the most. Again,
31:25
31:25 that’s al that’s our filtration. So as
31:27
31:27 we’re going out into the community or
31:29
31:29 working with the the military or even
31:31
31:31 our our c customers from another part of
31:33
31:33 the world like do you stand by these
31:36
31:36 values? Is this your person? Is this why
31:38
31:38 you want to launch? And so far yes. So I
31:40
31:40 think for me it’s bringing all those
31:41
31:41 stakeholders together and identifying
31:43
31:43 like why are we here? Why are we doing
31:45
31:45 this um and then that’s it that that
31:47
31:47 filtration then just keeps you going for
31:50
31:50 years um through all the challenges that
31:52
31:52 space brings along. At Future Forum we
31:55
31:55 like to ask you about leaving your lane
31:58
31:58 and you have truly demonstrated that.
32:01
32:01 You started off as a space economist.
32:04
32:04 What made you move across to this
32:07
32:07 entrepreneurial area? What what was the
32:10
32:10 driver? Talk to us about that.
32:12
32:12 >> Um it was timing I would say. I was
32:16
32:16 Yeah, I was doing um supporting the
32:18
32:18 spaceport in in Cormal. I I was actually
32:21
32:21 an aerospace economist, so I started out
32:23
32:23 more in aviation. I actually it’s a bit
32:25
32:25 of a secret, but I like airplanes more
32:27
32:27 more than spacecraft. Um and I just had
32:30
32:30 the opportunity to get involved um early
32:33
32:33 on in my career in space. And and then I
32:36
32:36 had the opportunity when my predecessor
32:38
32:38 left to take the helm of the spaceport.
32:41
32:41 Uh a lot of people didn’t think I could
32:43
32:43 do it. I didn’t really fit the mold,
32:44
32:44 let’s just say, of of what a director of
32:46
32:46 a spaceport looked like. And I and I
32:48
32:48 totally went out of my comfort zone to
32:50
32:50 do that. And I learned from the best.
32:52
32:52 And that’s it. And I think having no
32:53
32:53 ego, you’re never going to be the
32:55
32:55 smartest in the room, especially in the
32:57
32:57 space industry. So I would surround
32:59
32:59 myself with the smartest people and
33:01
33:01 absolutely listen to what they had to
33:02
33:02 say about things and challenged, you
33:04
33:04 know, anything that I thought would
33:06
33:06 maybe differently and not be afraid to.
33:08
33:08 And so anybody that mentored me along
33:10
33:10 the way uh incredibly grateful for
33:13
33:13 because it then has allowed me to jump
33:14
33:14 into another massive challenge um of
33:17
33:17 building another one uh and still being
33:19
33:19 out of my comfort zone. Definitely it’s
33:21
33:21 another level up from what we did in
33:23
33:23 Cornwall. Um, but yeah, it’s just
33:25
33:25 surrounding myself, my team or I mean, I
33:27
33:27 have an extra astronaut on my team and
33:29
33:29 I’m never going to be smarter than the
33:31
33:31 next astronaut. So, again, sitting down
33:33
33:33 with him on a daily basis to just like,
33:35
33:35 okay, tell me why you do it this way.
33:37
33:37 What’s this? And and just constantly
33:38
33:38 learning. I absolutely love it. My brain
33:40
33:40 is fried every single day in a good way.
33:42
33:42 Um, so challenging yourself, dropping
33:44
33:44 the ego. I’m not ever going to know
33:46
33:46 anything as much as these people. So,
33:48
33:48 um, learn learn as much as I can.
33:52
33:52 You’re obviously doing a job that you
33:54
33:54 know how to do best and only you can do
33:56
33:56 this and you’re leaving the others to
33:58
33:58 their expertise which is always a sign
33:60
33:60 of a great leader.
34:02
34:02 I want to talk now about looking in the
34:05
34:05 rear view mirror. So what do you wish
34:09
34:09 you knew when you entered the industry
34:12
34:12 for the first time now that you know
34:14
34:14 now? What have you learned and what did
34:16
34:16 you wish you knew?
34:18
34:18 Um,
34:21
34:21 not to make it all about me, but I I I
34:23
34:23 wish I knew that I could do it. Um,
34:26
34:26 because I think I spent a lot of years
34:28
34:28 and and and probably being a woman, you
34:30
34:30 you tend to second guess yourself
34:32
34:32 sometimes. Um, when you’re in a room and
34:33
34:33 in an industry dominated by by men. Um,
34:36
34:36 so yeah, I wish I knew that I was going
34:39
34:39 to be as, you know, successful in my
34:41
34:41 career as I have been because I think
34:42
34:42 then it would have saved me a bit of
34:44
34:44 time and um, speaking up when when I
34:46
34:46 should have. Um, I also wish I knew that
34:48
34:48 this industry is incredibly friendly and
34:51
34:51 welcoming. It does not seem like that
34:53
34:53 from the outside. I know that. And my
34:55
34:55 background being in in the aviation
34:57
34:57 world was not as friendly. This is
34:59
34:59 incredibly friendly. It’s really
35:00
35:00 diverse. The whole industry is like
35:03
35:03 we’re in it together. It’s very small
35:05
35:05 still. And I think I wish that I had
35:07
35:07 known that you can approach somebody
35:09
35:09 from NASA and ask them a question and
35:10
35:10 they will be more than happy to help
35:12
35:12 you. It is that is it gives me so much
35:15
35:15 hope. Um, no matter what’s going on in
35:17
35:17 the world geopolitically, the space
35:19
35:19 industry are are really like I I really
35:22
35:22 want people to know that pretty much the
35:24
35:24 majority of everybody in this industry
35:26
35:26 wants the best for our planet. Most of
35:29
35:29 them are environmentalists and they are
35:32
35:32 really here for the right reasons. And
35:34
35:34 so I wish that I had known that as well.
35:36
35:36 And I’m really glad that I do know that
35:38
35:38 now because it if I ever have a
35:39
35:39 challenge, even this morning, I I
35:41
35:41 couldn’t figure out a specific problem
35:43
35:43 and I I phoned up somebody I know down
35:44
35:44 in the US that’s that works for NASA and
35:46
35:46 they were able to help me. Um, so yeah,
35:48
35:48 I know that sounds a bit ethereal, but
35:50
35:50 it’s the it’s the best thing about about
35:52
35:52 what I do.
35:55
35:55 >> Interesting that aviation is so
35:57
35:57 different to this uh sector.
36:01
36:01 >> Why do you think that is?
36:03
36:03 I think because aviation started a lot
36:06
36:06 longer ago and I don’t know it has a lot
36:10
36:10 more connotations to maybe the military.
36:14
36:14 Um it it’s way more male-dominated than
36:17
36:17 even spaces I’ve found. Um I found it’s
36:20
36:20 more business big big business
36:24
36:24 and so you get the the the stereotypes
36:27
36:27 around that. Um, I would say I’m very
36:31
36:31 glad to be in the space industry. As
36:32
36:32 much as it still has some of that in it,
36:34
36:34 it’s definitely not as much. There’s
36:36
36:36 there’s it’s a very small crew still and
36:40
36:40 globally in the space industry. Um,
36:42
36:42 whereas aviation I think is there’s a
36:43
36:43 lot more, you know, elements to it. Uh,
36:46
36:46 but yeah, I didn’t necessarily have the
36:48
36:48 best time as a woman in in aviation,
36:51
36:51 which is surprising. You’d think there’d
36:53
36:53 be more egos in the space industry. So
36:57
36:57 pleased to hear that.
36:59
36:59 Looking forward to the next decade. What
37:01
37:01 are you most excited about? You spoke
37:04
37:04 emphatically about space really helped
37:06
37:06 us to understand it. What drives you?
37:10
37:10 What do you think is going to be what
37:12
37:12 your daughter’s going to be experiencing
37:13
37:13 in 10 years time? If there is a place
37:17
37:17 for everybody in in space and somehow
37:20
37:20 that feels like I’ll have done my job
37:23
37:23 well. I think the outreach that we’ve
37:25
37:25 done with education,
37:27
37:27 um, it’s not just about being an
37:28
37:28 astronaut. There’s so many different
37:30
37:30 jobs that you can do. If it’s accessible
37:32
37:32 to a wider group of people around the
37:34
37:34 world, that will be be huge because the
37:36
37:36 minute you start to bring in people from
37:38
37:38 different backgrounds into an industry,
37:40
37:40 that’s when you start to get uh the more
37:43
37:43 responsible behavior because people will
37:44
37:44 question it from different sides and it
37:46
37:46 won’t just be one demographic looking at
37:48
37:48 a problem. And so for me I think space
37:50
37:50 has that opportunity to engage a wider
37:53
37:53 array of people bring them into the
37:55
37:55 industry at an exact moment as we have
37:57
37:57 this huge opportunity. So for me in 10
38:00
38:00 years time if my daughter and all her
38:03
38:03 friends at school have some sort of you
38:06
38:06 know association with space in one way
38:08
38:08 or another then I think that’s great cuz
38:10
38:10 I think that will lead us to a better
38:12
38:12 environment to to to look out to is is
38:15
38:15 space if if it’s seen through people’s
38:17
38:17 eyes that maybe traditionally we
38:19
38:19 haven’t. Um so for me it’s that uh I I I
38:23
38:23 can’t wait to see where this goes. I
38:24
38:24 know the people working on the
38:25
38:25 challenges now and I do think so one
38:28
38:28 thing I will say a passion project for
38:30
38:30 me will be seeing you know how bad the
38:32
38:32 wildfires have been this year around the
38:34
38:34 world especially here in Canada my dad
38:36
38:36 used to fight forest fires in in water
38:38
38:38 bombers I would love space to solve that
38:41
38:41 challenge as best as we possibly can and
38:43
38:43 there’s some incredible projects on that
38:44
38:44 right now so that’s my little side side
38:47
38:47 project that I’d love to see come to
38:48
38:48 fruition so I’d love you to leave a memo
38:52
38:52 for the future about leadership, about
38:55
38:55 your passion about space. Tell us what
38:58
38:58 it would be.
39:00
39:00 >> My memo to the future would be in space.
39:03
39:03 It feels cold and harsh and we’re not
39:05
39:05 associated with it down here on Earth,
39:07
39:07 but as we do, I want us all to think
39:10
39:10 about kindness as a strength. Um, I have
39:13
39:13 used kindness throughout my career and
39:15
39:15 it is not a weakness, it is a strength.
39:18
39:18 And I think as we go towards a new
39:19
39:19 economy on orbit, if we keep kindness at
39:23
39:23 our human heart, um, to get us to where
39:26
39:26 we need to be up there, to not make the
39:28
39:28 same mistakes as we did back down here
39:30
39:30 on planet Earth, and to use space to
39:34
39:34 benefit more people, um, I think we’ll
39:37
39:37 see some really, really incredible
39:39
39:39 futures for all of humanity out out in
39:42
39:42 in orbit. So, I think kindness is a
39:44
39:44 strength. be kind to ourselves, be kind
39:46
39:46 to our planet, and be kind to our new
39:48
39:48 planets out in orbit, I think, is is key
39:51
39:51 to to making it a success.
39:55
39:55 >> Awesome. Thank you, Melissa. Really
39:58
39:58 appreciate your time on Future Forum.
40:01
40:01 You are inspirational.
40:02
40:02 >> Thank you.
40:03
40:03 >> Thank you so much.
40:04
40:04 >> Well, massive thanks to Melissa Quinn,
40:06
40:06 our guest today, and of course to my
40:09
40:09 brilliant co-host, Victoria Usher. Uh
40:11
40:11 that’s today’s guest. Somebody inspiring
40:14
40:14 us to look to the skies and beyond and
40:17
40:17 crucially like a constellation of stars
40:20
40:20 to join the dots between governments,
40:23
40:23 markets, communities, military and many
40:26
40:26 more. Besides, really hope you’ve
40:28
40:28 enjoyed it as much as we both have.
40:30
40:30 Please do share that conversation with
40:32
40:32 anyone you think uh would find it
40:34
40:34 inspiring. And do stay tuned. If you
40:37
40:37 want to hear more about everything going
40:38
40:38 on at Future Forum, please do subscribe
40:41
40:41 to our new newsletter. We’ll put a link
40:44
40:44 in the comments and the section
40:45
40:45 underneath this podcast. Uh, it’s Future
40:48
40:48 Forum. It’s tomorrow. I’m Ollie Barrett
40:51
40:51 and until next time, goodbye.